dakarboy

me and brooklyn rob was kicking back a couple of cold ones talking about my old guzzi, women and adv rider, not necessarily in that order when he said he would like to see his bike in advrider, other then when he crashes it trying to go over little hills......okay, it was a big hill or so i am told. so i offered to document his service and we could post that on advrider. no crashes, i hope. with the understanding that the service would take longer we agreed to do it. or should i say, i agreed to do it.

so this may be boring. if you could give two shits what happens during the 12k service on a f650 move on. nothing to see here. if you want to see what a trained monkey looks like spinning wrenches, you have come to the right place! turn the page. or scroll down.


every bike should get a preliminary test ride. it doesnt have to be long. this one was only three miles but i was able to confirm one complaint, that he had a small wobble/weave at around 45 mph. and;

get it hot enough to observe the fan run and shut itself off. the other thing i really like to do is to check for any codes. that will have to wait till the end because i did not activate my GS911 in time and for reasons that will be revealed later i cannot spin the motor over now. but, his bike ran good, started right up and other then a little more backfiring then i would like, gave me no reason to suspect any problems.



so with a piping hot bike, its time to change the oil.

if you can still turn the bars move them over to expose these two guys on the left and right and loosen them but do not take them out.

i cannot stomach it when i see a bike getting its oil changed cold. plus, i have never had a stuck filter or plug and i never change the oil cold.

take off the signal mount, disconect it, do not let it hang. it could scratch something or damage the wires.

before you pull off the panel make sure you remove the oil filler/dipstick. pull the panel up over the neck and put it somewhere safe.

this exposes the oil bag. loosen the drain bolt with out removing it before you take it off its mounts. then remove the torx and two retaining clips and washers;

one quick way to tell if someone has been hacking away at your bike is to look for the two black nylon washers. the clips are a PITA to put on if they are in place. very easy if not. but they have to serve a purpose right? otherwise the fuhrer would not have put them there!
now pull the oil bag free of its posts and remove the drain plug and let it piss away.


next comes the engine drain;

you can snake wrench in there but if it gives you any trouble, pull the engine guard and skid plate and attack it with a socket. i had no problems and it came right out!

yeah it makes a mess, nothing a can of brake cleaner cant handle. besides, i dont want to try to remove all that stuff after Rob was making little rocks out of big rocks with his engine guard! shits all bent to hell!

now to the oil filter; remove this;

and this;

and then the two lower bolts but just loosen the top one and break the seal.

like so. after it is mostly drained, about one minute, i like to start the bike and let it run for 1 sec. you will be surprised how much more oil comes out. if you took the filter out, now would be a good time to clean your gargage wall! now, have a beer, eat lunch whatever. give the oil a chance to drain completely. remove the filter and you are ready to move on. thats all i have time for now. will post more later as the time allows.
pardon my grammer and cheers.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

i forgot to show Rob's drain bolt. check it for chunky bits of steel and excessive metal sludge. this one is fine. dont forget to check the case for the crush washer, the one for this plug went swimming

next i want to dig the battery out and get it serviced so it can go on charge right away. to do that you now take the right side panel off and center one as well. this is another way to see if the techs that work on your scoot care about what they are doing; see this rubber gasket? it always either stays with the bike or falls off somewhere. its all in the details.


remove the battery negative cable first and then get overflow tube. hopefully it was installed correctly and your bike is not wrotting away in front of your very eyes. then you give it a bath. dirt conduct electricity and can add corrosion.

then top it off with distilled water;

then load test it;

then put it to sleep for the night.

i am going to go check on the little one to see how she is doing. more to come!

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

evanphoto

i look forward to following this thread. you're in good hands, brooklyn bob, and it was nice to meet you the other day. keep the report flowing.

__________________
"It’s a good feeling when they stand up and fight us. If 10 of them are gonna decide to stand up and fight us, I can tell you 10 of them are gonna die,"
Cpt. Schneider, US Army in Iraq, 2004

ppuga

Great Thread for Dakar owners. Please, continue when you can!

michnus

Excellent, this thread is marked on my favorites list

Waiting for the rest..............

dakarboy

i have 45 mins to kill before its time to get it done on R's bike. hopefully big brown will drop off the much needed parts(more on that later) so i can wrap up this project. but if something happens with the parts or something i know that R is not concerned as i promised him he could use my never abused, never down 03. no worries right?




so, we have the lifeblood drained and the battery on the road to recovery. next up is getting to the valves and taking care of some stuff on the way. like the air horn/filter/box removal. first disconnect the air temp sensor;

then remove these two small torx screws;

then expose the air filter;

after you remove the airfilter look inside the box, if you see and excessive amount of oil in there its possible that your bike was overfilled at the last oil change. if the oil service was done correctly and you checked it wrong and added oil then you over filled it. more on that later. R had very little oil in his, consistant with the fact that his last ride involved him falling alot. but not because of inexperience but because he is smoking fast in the dirt!
so clean out the oil and deep six the air filter.

next remove these two bolts;

i did not take a picture of it for some reason but you can remove the airbox now and let it hang by the crankcase vent hose. stuff a rag down the throttle body so nothing can fall in there. my buddy likes to use his shop glove and put it over it. either way.
i thought i took a pic, here it is;


next, remove the electrical box cover;

then the battery tray/air horn mount;

next the throttle cable and valve cover vent hose;

i use a pick to lever up one side of the clamp. once off, throw that shit away. they suck and never reseal the way they do new. a properly sized zip tie will work just fine thank you very much.

then remove the throttle cable by turning the plastic knurled nut and then pulling towards the front of the bike to free it from the holder and then towards you to release it completely;

now this is very important for later kiddies, make not of the hole the cable nipple lives in. why? because it can use both and goes in both equally well. but one of the holes only allows the throttle to open 1/4 of the way. very bad the first time you go to merge on the highway. i would never make that mistake...

next pull off the heat shield, pull the throttle cable through its access hole. dont forget to feed it through during assembly. there is no bolts or screws, it is just a key hole and post;

now pull off the overflow tank. since we are doing a coolant flush as part of the service its just as easy to pull it completely off and drain it. also, when you pull it out you will see ther is a post on the back side of the bag. if you look in the cavity the tank just left you will see a rubber grommit where that post goes. the tank will go in weather its in that post or not. get your bike back from a service and hear something clunking around or it just doesnt sound the same?;

next, remove the coil holder;

the coils, be sure twist them left and right to free them before you pull them up. pull them straight up, you do not want to snap the end of the plug in the coild or damage the coils. another thing is the electrical connectors. they are delicate, use care when removing;

now use shop air to blow around the spark plugs to remove any debris. can you see the kamikaze bee at the base of the plug? how do they make that far in. these are questions that need answers. also, since the valve cover is coming off next, i blow all around that area as well. btw, you did remember to cover the throttle body right.....? i am sure nothing big dropped in there.

now pull the plugs;

his looked good. nice and worn, good color and very little in the way of deposits. fuel injected bikes are the bomb. excuse me E, i meant to say, YO dis shit da bomb! did you know on this bike the two plugs fire independantly of each other? pu that in your pipe and smoke it!

gotta go finish this technical marvel! more later and as usual please forgive my grammer and general butchery of the english language.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

Paul II

Dakarboy,

thanx for taking the time to post your work. Looking forward to the valve check.

Paul

DAM

it all made good sense up until this point.

nice write up and pictures

__________________
"The Internet is a great place to get on the net"

Bob Dole

PAY YOUR MORTGAGE IN AS LITTLE HALF THE TIME OR LESS, REALLY!

dakarboy

do you think damage is being done to the engine by letting it run to clear out the remaining dirty oil from the cavities? even if its only one sec? i really only crank it over till i hear it catch then kill it. i do it to every dry sump bike i work on. never had any problems, yet.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

i am as far as i can get until ups shows up. so i will try to catch up until they do. i did not get a picture of it, but, everything we did up to this point was to expose the valve cover to remove it and check the valves. i did not get a picture of the valve cover removal but it is straight forward and easy. just remove the bolts and take it out. this is what it looks like when you have done that;


so then i finally was able to use this tool that i have had for awhile to remove the inspection/access cap.

i want to apologize to anyone following this. it seems i did not capture all of the valve check part of this service. this is what is missing;
1)inserting the proper allen wrench in the access hole to rotate the motor to TDC

2)this can be determined by the cam lobes point away from their respective valves as picture above.

3)inserting the proper sized feeler gauge between the bucket and cam lobe.
10-15 intake and 25-30 exhaust.

what happened at this point was unexpected. i beat the shit out of my mule and i did not need a valve adjustment until 36k. R's had two valves out of spec. both on the right hand side.




so as you can clearly see, some shims will need swapped. now there are times when i will not do the adjustment like if it is a loose 30 very tight 35 or tight 10 loose 5 but this was not the case. so, the cams need to come out. also, i was not aware that bmw had switched to a shim under bucket valve design. this concerned me alot because i told R that i had a shit load of shims and would be able to turn him around no problem. well, i dont have of any of the little ones.

so to pull the cams the first thing that needs to be done is to pull the tensioner bolt. and to pull the tensioner you need to move this out of the way;

and to get to that you need to pull this out of the way;

i smoother over this, its four mounting bolts and unbolting the fuel filter/reg and unscrewing the elec junction.

then unbolt the banjo bolt on the bottom of the motor here;

then remove this tiny torx bolt that hold the line next to the tensioner;

then remove the tensioner bolt but not the tensioner;

then unbolt the upper cam chain guide and the cam block bolts. when removing the cam block bolts i ease them out a 1/4 turn at a time in cross pattern until loose then remove them with a socket the rest of the way.

then remove the bolts being very careful not to lose a washer, then the top cam block, the remove the chain from the sprockets, then the cams, then the lower block. you should secure the chain so it does not fall into the tunnel. if you drop it in there dont panic. use a magnet or long hook to fish it out the use a mirror to verify the correct orientation of the cam chain to engine sprocket. after you have pulled off the above components, this is what you will have;

then remove the bucket. be very careful, the shim can stick to the bottom of the bucket then drop into who knows where and give you fits trying to find it. we turned on mc upside down using a winch and tow motor to get a shim to fall back out from the engine! hey it worked!


once the shim is in your hand clean it with a lint free cloth. do not believe any thing posted on the shim if it is still readable. mic that SOB;

the exhaust shim

the intake
so from here is where some people consult graphs and charts and do all sorts of math. or you can just minus or add depending on your spec the differance to existing shim to get your new shim size. so the exhaust is a 2.65 shim and its .05 to much so we need to add .005 to this shim. so we need a 2.7 shim to drop the clearance to 30 mm. get it? the intake is a 2.87 and the spec size is .05 too tight so we need minus this from 2.87 to get the clearance up to at least 10. because shims only run in increments of .05 i ordered a 2.8 and a 2.85. so now you know what i am waiting for! i am going to go check for the ups douche bag.

the shims

a shim and bucket;

gotta go. cheers

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

ChrisC

The next guy that says "640's are too hard too service" is gonna be directed here.

Nice write up...

p.s. the last time I had to "drain my bag" was when the doc left a stitch in after my vasectomy.

__________________
Chris
'03 KTM Adventure 640
'43 BSA M20WD

dakarboy

640's have threaded adjusters right? so it would be easier, but not by much...

sorry to hear about your ball sack. its a standing policy i have not to let any one near mine with anything sharp!

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

Van Isle

This is most excellent! Much appreciated.

VI

dakarboy

well its 15 fucking 20 and no ups. R just called wanting to know what was up. looks like its up his right now for paying for overnight and not delivering, but there still is time. i have faith that MAX's will come through!

in the mean time, let me try to finish this;

so, the next major evolution in this job is to get the fork oil changed. i did not get a pic of the oil draining but you all know where the drain bolts are right? so i have to remove the fork tube tops. first take off his holder and switch mounting plate;

then unbolt the handle bar clamps. you want to protect the gauges and handlebar from damage so cover everything with a protective cover and secure the handle bar with a bungee cord or what ever you have.

then loosen both side upper pinch bolts;

then remove the upper fork caps. be sure and lift the front end of the mc off the ground or it will collapse on you. not fun stuff.

btw, if this is your bike and you do not care what it looks like then take them off with whatever you have. but most guys or gals, like to get their rides bike the way they came in, unmarred. you can save the finish on the caps, even if they are aluminum just by putting a rag over them before you remove them. like so;

bmw reccomends 7.5 weight oil. and that works fine if your name is dani pedrosa and your bulimic. for the average american or worse, its just not enough. i used this;

i guess it goes with out saying that i have already installed the drain bolts using new crush washers and all that. so with the fluid added, reinstall the caps. i start them with a very stubby wratchet. they are very fine thread and can cross very easily. when they are snug, i cover them with a rag and tighten them up.

since it is exposed i decided to tighten the steering head bearings. remember the wobble at 45mph? so, using the rag technique, remove the upper bridge nut;

then the adjusting allen bolt (more on that later);

then you adjust the tightness by tightning or loosening the adjusting collar;

a little goes a long way. i adjust them till the front wheel slowly drops to the left or right when in the air. it should need no prompting. now, bmw has a specific way to adjust these bearings. the only time i have seen it in action was at school. it is very scientific and worked well at school. away from school i could never get it right. i would be constantly adjusting and adjusting till i just did the way i have been doing it my whole life. i am not saying that the bmw way with the dial indicator and torque values cannot work, its just like trying to re-invent the wheel. the old way was easy and fast. then you tighten or re-install everything in reverse order. do not forget the upper pinch bolts.

next comes the handlebars, and make sure you slather the bolts with antisieze!


btw, on jap bikes there is a punch mark to specify the orientation of the clamps. bmw have no mark and they are directional. look at them, can you see the difference?

they will go on wrong and then strip out as you try to tighten them up. when installing them, screw them in, all four, about halfway, then screw the two fwd ones till the clamp touches the bridge, then hand tighten the rears and torque them front to back to 18ft lbs.

going to go and see if the ups guy dropped it off with out ringing the bell.

cheers.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

g&*#)^n f#&^!@g ups! still waiting. three oclock my ass!

all right, we are patiently waiting, in the mean time. i had pointed out that his pads were low (15/25 front/rear%left) and he said "change em". well, we could go buy a bmw set for what, $50? for one set? my friends at www.beemerboneyard.com sell more then just used parts. they hooked me up with a set of these and are quality pieces at half the price. plus, i dont know if this is just coincidence but my brakes have stopped that horrible squealing!

i always apply anti squeal, though with the beemers its hit or miss if it works.

so, as part of the service, the bike must have a brake flush. and where is the most dirty brake fluid to be found? usually where all the work is being performed. here

so i spray the shit out of it with brake clean and then blow it with shop air;

then i attach a bleeder hose, but wait, i am getting ahead of myself. first things first, the reservoir needs cleaned inside and out and then filled with fresh fluid;


looks better right?! then you break the bleader, attach the hose, and since we are replacing the pads, gently force the piston all the way back into its bore and watch all the shit come out of the hose;

the pictures do not do it justice, it was black! then you just keep the valve open and pump the pedal till it comes out clear. when pumping the pedal do not push it to the full extent of its travel. its not designed to go that far and can cause premature failure. now this is what it is supposed to look like;



now to change the rear pads. pull the retaining pin;

drive the pin out with a drift punch;

remove the old pads and install the new ones. you should clean the slide pin and apply (sparingly) a bit of grease. also, check to see that the caliper slides freely in and out on the hangar. if it does not it needs to come off and appart. have fun. a clue that you might have this problem is when one pad is about 60% left and the other is metal to metal.

i was going to show all the pictures from the front brakes and pads but they are almost exactly the same. now, before you bmw techs start hitting me over the head about the brake flush, i know, its not yet finished. you see, the abs pump has reservoirs that are only accessed when the pump is activated. so there is a menu in the GT1 diagnostic machine that activates the abs pump so that fluid has a chance to escape. i am going to have to do it the hard way, actually go out and make the abs kick in front and rear! should be fun...


i am going to go check for the UPS guy. fuckin sound like a broken record.

i have to drop the kids off at the pool so i will take care of that too!

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

SimpleSimon

Nice write up! I just went through this exercise myself before a long ride last week. The only thing I didn't do was adjust the steering.

__________________
2003 BMW F650 GS in Black (Fastest color avail)

Brooklyn Rob

Keith:
This is one of the coolest threads ever. We rock.

If you want, I could break some more shit for my 18k service. I'm sure our F650 brothers would eagerly await the next chapter of the saga.

P.S.: Couldn't you rig up some of your numerous bottlecaps as valve shims? They looked about the right size to me.

Rob

brewer90

For future reference you don't need to remove the oil tank to drain it. Just put the bike on the sidestand and let it drain. The few extra drops you get out aren't worth the extra time. Of course you had to remove it anyway for the valve check.

Also you can pull the cams without having to remove the tensioner which will prevent you from having to take the whole damn bike apart. It takes a little patience to get the move just right but nowhere near as long as what you went through removing everything.

Brooklyn Rob

Hi Poops.

canuck479

I might also suggest zip tying the cam sprockets to the cam chain befor removing from the cams that way going to gether is much easier and timing is not an issue. Also plugs should always be checked after the valves.

__________________
What fun is being an adult if you can't act like a kid

brewer90

You consider that pooping on a thread? You've been around here long enough to know what poop looks like and suggestions on time savings isn't it.

hondo

Once finished, this looks like a Hall of Wisdom thread.

Great writeup!

__________________
KLRWorld.com & The KLRWorld.com Forums
CBRider.com Forums

dakarboy

hey rob, guess what got here about 20 mins ago?

the reason the tank is pulled is because in most shops, bikes are tied to lifts and its easier to remove it and let it hang then move the bike around.

the oil line can be worked around, but why? you run the risk of rounding the tensionor bolt out. which gives you alot more room to work when yanking out the cams.

why in gods green earth would i want to ziptie the sprockets to the cam chain? makes no sense. they gotta come out.

i am having alot of fun with this though. i have probably two more posts before i am finished.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

brewer90

I see your point on the oil tank/lift.

You don't need to work around the oil line or even touch the cam chain tensioner bolt. Zip tie the cams to the cam chain so you don't lose your timing. Remove the cam carriers and set aside. Now wiggle the front cam until it comes loose. You now have enough room to replace the both the intake shims. Repeat on the back cam for the exhaust. I'll try to find a picture which will explain this better than I can.

Here is a pic

Brooklyn Rob

No need to get your knickers in a wad.
My message is to someone who knows who they are.

brewer90

No problem. I thought your knickers were in a wad. Hi Poops whomever you are.

dakarboy

the only time you should touch those bolts is if you are working on a central tunnel dohc 4 cyld. just pull the cams on singles and anything with side driven cams. and as for the timing, you put it together the way it came apart.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

Brooklyn Rob

Those brown shirted assholes!
Wait, I seem to recall another group of a holes in brown shirts...

dakarboy

you lost me rob.....

did you still want to come over and wrap this up? we might be done by two or three pessimistacally, midnight optimistically....damn, two big words back to back did i spell em right jeb?

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

oh, i just got it. a little slow on the uptake...

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

i am out of here. will see you tuesday.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

DougRoost

What a PITA. Makes any other bike look brilliant. I know what d/s bike I WON'T be buying.

__________________
Doug
1999 KTM 300 E/XC -- even better now that it's an EG-310.
Looking for an adventure bike to add to it
Austin MotoSports Association www.amsaclub.org

dakarboy

the service between a 640 adv and this bike are very close. the suspension fluid change is much easier on the dakar. the valves are harder to adjust, but done only every 12k versus 6k for the katoom. so it is really a wash. its just that i am breaking it down move for move, and since you have an obvious dislike for the bike, you see the negative. whatever, very few ktm riders are going to trade there 525 in on a dakar. that would mean you would actually have to ride the bike you bought instead of trailering it everywhere!

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

DougRoost

Removing a pair of cams and going through the whole shim and bucket thing is a real hassle compared to the screw adjust ones like the LC4 uses. It's racier and I understand the trade-off to get high RPMs, but not worth it for this use IMO. I cannot believe how much you have to remove to get at the head. I know those Rotax engines are really smooth and the fuel tank below the seat means it carries it's weight low so guess that's the trade-off.

I rode my friend's F650GS and was impressed by how smooth it was and easy to ride. But it's definitely more of a streetbike than I'm looking for....seems a 640e is what I need to add to my 300 2-stroke. Incidentally, I've been driving BMW cars for a very long time and do all my own work on them. Fortunately, they're much more straightforward than this.

__________________
Doug
1999 KTM 300 E/XC -- even better now that it's an EG-310.
Looking for an adventure bike to add to it
Austin MotoSports Association www.amsaclub.org

Colorado Uli

Man, and I was actually considering doing this job on my '02 Dakar over the weekend. Now, I'm not so sure about it. Yeah, I do all my own light maintenance and have even put in an Ohlins shock without much difficulty, but this looks like a good way to screw up the engine even worse then it was if you're not an experienced mechanic with a full set of tools.

How much is the BMW shop gonna charge me for the shim change (assuming they need changing)?

__________________
"No honestly Sir, I didn't see that there sign"

2002 - F650GS Dakar (old gray mare)

dakarboy

there should be one flat charge just to check them, if they need adjusting then the labor and parts will go up accordingly. the shims cost about 35 from max. sometimes there is an shim exchange. if there is not, get your old ones back. keep em honest!

listening to all the responses to this is making me realize i do not charge enough.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

greer

Colorado Uli,

You have a single-spark bike with shim over bucket. It'll be easier, at least that's what I keep telling myself, haven't had to adjust anything yet. And we can use KLR shims, supposed to be cheaper,too. If you decide to use BMW shims it pays to shop around a little, evidently the price of shims varies a great deal shop to shop; seems like somebody said Irv Seaver had extra-good prices. Look here for how-to:
http://faq.f650.com/GSFAQs/Valve_Shim_Change_FAQ_GS.htm

Sarah

__________________
'02 F650GS

evanphoto

hey dakar guy,
would you do a service write up for me on advrider? as you know, i have an xr650L and it needs some service. what is your cell number? What are your shop hours?



Maybe we can put on the header pipes and adjust the carb. I also need my brakes done and fluids changed. I haven't changed my brake fluid in years! It is a 2003, do I need to worry about a fork oil change?

I am also thinking of getting a ktm 530exc r or ktm640a. I haven't decided yet. Question is, i know you know the honda inside and out but are you comfortable working on ktm's?

And as far as b rob's bike, it needs a chain lube and you need a few beers!

__________________
"It’s a good feeling when they stand up and fight us. If 10 of them are gonna decide to stand up and fight us, I can tell you 10 of them are gonna die,"
Cpt. Schneider, US Army in Iraq, 2004

Wannabex2

My shop was going to charge about $350 for the 6k service, which includes a valve check.

It can easily be done over the weekend, if you plan it right. Removing all the parts to get to the valve cover takes about 20-30 minutes max. The only delay you may have is if you're valves are out of spec and you don't have any shims. Then you have to get some.

IIRC, the tools you need are mostly torx bits, a 6mm and 8mm allen, a tdc bolt (home made), a 15/16" and 10mm socket and feeler guages. I use a torque wrench to button everything back down to specs.

Changing the oil takes about 15-30min. depending on how long you let the oil drain. I bought a cheap funnel with a diameter slighty larger than the oil filter and cut it it so it would jam up nicely below the filter housing to minimize the mess. I stuck the end of the funnel and to a 24oz bottle (a 12oz wold work) and taped it so the oil would drain into that.

Once you check the valves. Write down the specs. If one needs changing
then pull the cams out and measure all the shims. It will help you be ready for next time.

Before I pulled the cams on mine I marked my the position of the cam marks at TDC on my yellow chain guide with a permanent marker.

I pull the cams out on mine (instead if tensioner bolt method). It was difficult to get the back one out first, but once I placed a round lever in the cog hole and gently pulled up on it it came off easy.

If you need more details than this awesome post provides, check the FAQS at http://www.f650.com there's even two videos on checking the valves.

__________________
You have achieved victory when there is no one left to kill but yourslef.

JAFO

s: same here. thing is, I've had a hardon for an F650GS for a while now. Wanted to trade my 650R for one.

Glad that's past

__________________
"Frank Bama once said the best navigators are not quite sure where they're going until they get there... and then they're still not sure." -Don't Chu-Know by Jimmy Buffett.

1990 Jeep XJ- 7", 35s, diesel repower in progress- 5.7/700R4/NP231C
1989 S-10 Blazer- 31s, 5.7 diesel/700R4/NP231C
2006 Ninja 650r- first bike, let the hooligan loose!
1998 KLR685- this is why I learned to ride
1994 Jeep ZJ: 3", 33s, wife's DD
1987 Fiero GT (err.. in pieces)

Wannabex2

Granted the first time will take you much longer, but it takes relatively very little time to do this, especially if the valves are in spec. Plus by taking all that stuff off, it forces you to inspect the air cleaner, battery, etc...

__________________
You have achieved victory when there is no one left to kill but yourslef.

JDLuke

I've been gearing myself up to do roughly this same service myself. Most of the work doesn't bother me, but the idea of digging into the valve train has always been a bit intimidating. This post has certainly shed some much-needed the process.


I will say that the Dakar is easier than the standard 650GS in one respect: The fork oil change. Those threaded caps must make the job much easier. For some reason BMW saw fit to use a plain stainless steel circlip (really just a piece of wire, no grab holes) as the device to hold the plug in the top of the stock GS forks. I swear I'm gonna upgrade to either Dakar or possibly WP forks before I have to dig those out again.

__________________
Chain Gang: F650803
MOA: 96850
AMA: 976197
C'mon, it's the Feds we're talkin about. Not rocket surgeons! - summerinmaine
Slow but sure, the adverb is dying.

spanker

I just recently did the valves on my GS. Per this post, don't mess with the chain tensioner, you don't have to. The most important thing is installing the locking bolt correctly @ TDC. Where I deviate is tie-wrapping the cam sprockets to the cam chain; don't bother. Before you do anything (after the locking bolt is installed), make an ACCURATE visual reference of where the cam sprocket alignment marks are. Do this AFTER you physically reach down and push in the chain tensioner and let it spring back. Note that with the chain tensioner installed and putting pressure on chain, there is no slack and correspondingly, no rocking of parts (should I rotate CW, CCW before I install the locking bolt and make a visual reference?). The point is just pull the cams out completely to give you maximum work space. Who cares if the chain is indexed to the cam sprockets? The important thing is that the cams are indexed to the CRANKSHAFT, not the chain. Just put it back the same way you found it! I tied a 1/8 in dia short length of rope through a hole in the intake cam sprocket at approx the 3 oclock position facing the bike from the port side. Grasp the rope, pull UP and AFT with your right hand while gently prying up the far-side of the cam with your left hand. Pulling on the rope will have the same effect of turning the cam sprocket CCW, which in turn puts pressure on the chain tensioner. This action provides just enough slack to pop the cam out of the lower cam cradle. When you are done with your shim job, put the exhaust cam back in first. Make sure there is no slack between the crank sprocket and the cam sprocket. LOOK at your index marks on the exhaust cam sprocket. Are they in the same spot they were when you took the cam out? If not, index the cam one tooth + or - and look again. Install the intake cam the same way you took it out. You have to take an educated guess as to where the marks will align. Pull UP and AFT with your rope through the cam sprocket while gently pushing DOWN on the cam. You will feel the chain tensioner compressing as you pull, and pop it right in. Are the marks where they were to start with? If not, re-index and try again. This must take all of five minutes max without tie-wrapping the crap out of everything. Before you button everything up, reach down and collapse the chain tensioner and let it spring back several times and release to make sure it didn't get hung up and an give you a false index mark reading. One last thing. When you tighten up the cam cradles (upper and lower), the bottom one is pinned with alignment dowels, the top one is not. Align the top cradle port-to-starboard with the lower cradle by observing and vertically aligning the machined vertical surface where the top chain guide bolts to. I wish I had pics but I wasn't smart enough to take any. This isn't hard, it's just tedious PITA work on these 650's.

__________________
'06 F650 GS, PIAA's, Anakee's, Caribou, HT racks, Zumo.

Brooklyn Rob

It also needs some mirrors.

dakarboy

i agree with almost everything you said. your point about the sprockets and chains is spot on. who cares? the referance points and crank position are whats important. also, the crank tool is worthless and dangerous. if you forget it, which is easy to do, and you dont rotate the motor over by hand before you start it, which you should, you run the risk of snapping off part of the tool. anyway, will finish the rest of this tomorrow or the next. just got back from oh and am friggin tired.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

so, its one oclock in the morning and i am comfortably wired from the three cups of coffee that it took to keep me awake from pa to orange nj so i will write whats left of what i have completed.

with the shims on ther way i finished what i could. it should be noted that none of the local shops to me stocked these shims but max had them on their shelf. i wish max would take over the bmw of manhattan operation. a mc shop should be run by mc people, not car people. just putting it out there.

i decide to wrap up most of the oil service by buttoning up the motor. first the drain plug, all cleaned and with a new crush washer. never use the old one. my thread, no arguing!

then clean the oring seating surface of any residual oil or grit;

then use dirty engine to coat the rubber gasket side of the new oil filter. we use dirty oil because it has burned off most of the detergents in new oil. those detergents create a seal between the rubber and alum and make the filter a bitch to get off. more critical on spin on filters.

then you install the new oring on the oil filter cover and use dirty oil on that as well;

then you install the cover and torque it down! please use he-man torque specs. i charge 50 bucks to repair stripped threads. 72" lbs, i have not stripped out a hole yet.

then install the sprocket cover and then the shock remote reservoir. abs dakars only. btw, there is a stopper that the reservoit sits on to ensure it is properly positioned. what could happen if you dont put it back there? i was told that it would put undue stress on the rubber nitro line. that could cause the world to stop spinning and plummit the universe into chaos. so here is that stopper;

dont say i did not warn you!


alright, since the oil bag is removed we will fill it up later. you should make a not for yourself and tap it to the ignition key or speedo face or somewhere that it will not go un-noticed that there is no oil in the engine.

for the last part of this post i want to ramble on a bit about it. this is the lubrication of all pivot points. what sucks about this is that it is time consuming and unless the points were really dry and gritty or frozen, the customer will not likely notice. the next tech who works on that part of the bike will, he will be impressed. the customer will not notice. now, if you just recieved your bike from a shop and all the pivot points are over sprayed with white stuff then congradulations, you were probably just taken for a ride and the lubrication of all your pivot points was done with a spray can and nothing was disassembled cleaned and lubricated. not to toot my own horn, but this a thread on how it is done correctly so let me show you;

first the rear brake pivot point. take off the foot peg mount removing the following three bolts;

sorry, i only took a picture of the top mounting bolt. the other two are on the bottom facing the deck.
then remove the rear mc pushrod retaing clip buy pushing the holder towards the front of the bike (if its installed right, more on that later) and pulling it free. then the push rod should pull free easily from the mc boot. then unbolt the pedal by removing this bolt and pull the pedal and its return spring off;

your parts inventory should like this and contain the following: foot rest mount plus three bolts (not in picture) pedal, pedal pivot bolt, pivot busing, pivot washer, return spring, pushrod and push rod retaining clip.

now clean them off untill they sparkle, lubricate them with axle grease and the threads of the pivot bolt with antisieze and your shit should look like this;

now assemble the same way you took it apart. you were paying attention right? the washer goes between the bushing and the frame. the spring orientation should be self explanatory. just look at the wear marks on the frame and pedal. also important, making sure the brake switch is positioned correctly;

now antisieze the peg mounting bolts and install that and your done with the rear brake pedal.

now for the front brake lever. this is the easy one. remove the nut on the bottom of the pivot pin then unscrew the pin with a flat head while pusing up from the bottom. you should be holding this ;

i havent seen anything this dry since my first wife!
clean it and lubricate it. do not forget the perch!

reassemble and thats that . you may be tempted to leave any excess residue as proof that you were there. do not. it will be a dirt magnate and will look like total shit in two days. also, if the customer does not see it, he will the first time he runs his nice detail towel over it.

next is the clutch lever pivot. for all intensive purposes, this is also a how to on changing your clutch. first off, spin your cable adjuster all the way in. what is wrong with this picture? how are you supposed to make an adjustment on the fly if you need a wrench to adjust it? hand tight only!

then using a monkey wrench, rotate the clutch arm counter clock wise to free up the nipple then release the arm;



then line up the slots on the knurled adjuster knob and the adjuster itself and pull the cable free;

next remove the pivot bolt with the nut and remove the clutch lever;

this picture really captures how dry this is. this guy would be scratching his head when his clutch cable snaps when he has had all the services. kids crying. be right back.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

the kid is happily doing what babies do when they are hungry!

so, clean and lubricate both cable ends, the clutch lever, and pivot bolt;


now reassemble in reverse order. when adjusting the cable, bmw says 1 to 2 mm's. i like more but on some bikes this will cause hard shifting. you know your bike, set it where it likes it. sometimes you can run out of adjustment. it is usually that you cannot give it enough free play, the adjuster is screwed all the way in or it is all the way in with just barely the right amount of free play. this means the arm is on wrong and needs to come off and over a tooth. there is more to report but i am tired.

oh yeah, rob wanted me to check out this switch to see if there was anything noticable about it. nothing to report! going to sleep. sorry about the grammar. sue me.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

i was just getting ready to head out the garage to finish R's bike and i thought i would look at what it is that i wrote at 2 am in the morn.

i just want to apologize for all the mis-spelled words and bad grammer. and when we were lubricating the clutch pivot points i was basically saying that if you needed to change the clutch cable, not the clutch itself, that is how you would do it.

and as for my first wife, she was a sweet kind inocent person and i apologize to her as well........

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

Colorado Uli

Thanks for the good news. I guess I'll dig ito it this coming weekend (still waiting for Ohlins to send my shock back to me after I managed to trash it in the mountains, so I've got down time anyhow).

Uli

__________________
"No honestly Sir, I didn't see that there sign"

2002 - F650GS Dakar (old gray mare)

dakarboy

the shim over bucket can be easier because if it is the right side valves that need adjusted, you can depress the bucket and snake the shim out with a magnet. if its the inside ones, its not as easy, you may have to still pull the cams or at least loosen the carrier enough to get the shim around the cam. i dont like prying on anything in that area so i just pull em.
good luck!

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

all right lets wrap this thing up.


to finish the chasis lube we need to push some grease through this tiny hole on the sidestand mount. if you have a non dakar then you will need to do the same for the centerstand. there is an adapter that is sold through most places that sell grease guns that allow this to work. sometimes they can get plugged. just use brake cleaner or wd40 to clear it then follow it up with the grease. clean up the excess and your done. i also put a wrench on it to ensure it is not coming loose.

then you have to remove the right combination switch like so. remove the top screw;

the bottom screw;

to reveal the throttle gear. **warning** if you have heated grips and start twisting on the throttle you may sever the wires to that grip, so refrain;

disconnect it from the cable and clean it, the pipe and the cable end. i squirt some type of lubricant into the pipe end. white lith will work. then i use gear lube on the gears. now it was very hard to capture it in photo but reinstall the gear so that when you rotate the throttle the arrow on the gear and the arrow on the throttle pipe line up. do you see it?

to check the alignment you will have to hold the white gear in place by hand to keep it from jumping. just make sure the arrows line up when the throttle is rotated and that you have the same amount of freeplay as when you started. now reassemble.

there are chassis lubes on this bike that bmw, in their infinite wisdom, decided not to include. these would be the swingarm, and linkages for the rear suspension. if your bike spends alot of time in water you should pull them apart, clean and lubricate. otherwise be prepared to pay. mine needed all new bearings everywhere. and of course bmw did not have them. real dirt bikes come with grease fittings. so thats it. i do not think i left anything out on the chasis lube. can anybody think of anything? let me know. lets finish the valves.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

so this is what came in the mail from max's.

lets do the exhaust first. we decided that we needed a 2.70 to tighten the clearance on the right side valve. just because they say 2.70 on them does not mean thats what they are. mic them. find the closest one and use it. this is what we had for 2.70;


not much of a differance i know but a differance all the same. we are going with the 2.70 shim. now clean everything. use a lint free rag to clean the bucket, the valve top, the shim and while your at it, clean the cams, carrier, mounting surface and valve cover surface. clean every time you do an evolution here. one piece of grit or dirt in the wrong place can make your life hell. when assembling these components do not assemble dry! i use this;

it is tacky and hangs around for awhile. i do not trust engine oil. what if you put it together and then are unable to start it for awhile? engine oil may run off and leave the component unprotected.


i use one drop of assembly lube in the shim recess as insurance that it does not move around and put the shim we selected in it like this;

now put the clean bucket over it. gently rotate while applying gentle downward pressure. sometimes they like to fight you. just dont force it.

now lets mic the shims for the intake and put that in place;


not much of a differance here. but we want increase the clearance as much as possible so we will use the smaller one.


same same, use the lube;

now this is something i should have pointed out when you pulled the carrier but you need to ensure that these two dowel pins are present. if they are not in the head check the bottom of the bottom carrier. if one is missing start looking. they usually stay with the head.

now coat the cam journal areas with the lube and place on the dowel pins. you may need to rock it gently to get them to sit on the dowels;

now install the cams exhaust first. referance your marks and make sure that the lobes point out. the intake is the harder one to complete but it is still very easy. once you think you have them correct reach around to the cam chain tensioner and push the push rod all the way in and double check the timing marks while you do so. mine were off requiring me to move the intake two teeth. after that;

now do not for get to put a drop or two the cam journals and lobes;

now use the lube on the upper carrier cam journal areas and place it over the installed cams. then thread all the carrier mounting bolts by hand. be sure to use clean engine oil on the threads of said bolts. be careful with the metal washers. then do an intial torque of this;

make sure that you are tightening the bolts using a inside out cross pattern. the torque to this;

now use a new crush washer on the cam chain tensioner bolt and install it;

now i feel this is the most important part. rotate the motor over by hand. first slowly one revolution. then just spin it till you have rotated the motor at least 10 revolutions. end it by placing the motor back on tdc;


this makes sure that everything is seated and compressed as it is going to be. lets take a look at are results.



i was hoping for a perfect 30 instead i got a loose 25 tight 30. close enough and within parameters!

now for the intake;


again i was hoping for a perfect 10 here but it was loose and the 15 was tight so it is close enough. so picking the right shims made a differance. and now these valves are good to go. for at least another 12k.

lets finish this. put the upper cam chain guide back on;

then the valve cover. dont for get about the two special bolts for the ignition coil mount. use oil on the threads and torque them to spec.


be right back.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

the oil pipe, new crush washers;

the mounting bolt for the pipe. i use a magnet to start it;

then airbox mount;

then the sparkies. dont for get to antisieze them bad boys! i will by a beer for the guy who can tell me whats wrong with the second picture.


then use a little dielectric grease for the coil connectors and install the coils and coil mount. no pic, sorry.

now install the heat shield, do not forget to route the cable;

connect the throttle cable to the cam and observe that the throttle opens all the way;

then the battery tray/airbox holder. then the electrical box cover and your scoot should look like this;

when installing the battery tray do not forget to instll the battery overflow tube in its clip;

then install the airbox, air filter and horn. do not forget to install the airtemp sensor and to put the horn end in its place;
all right, smugmug just froze on me. will try later.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

then install the airbox, air filter and horn. do not forget to install the airtemp sensor and to put the horn end in its place;



then reinstall the oil bag and fill it with oil. R likes the good stuff! ;

then install the overflow tank, do not forget the grommit that it lives in. then fill it up with coolant. for some reason i did not take any pics of that evolution. it is pretty easy. just after you fill it you need to burp it. my bike came with a bleeder valve. the newer ones do not. just fill it. start it and let it run for a minute or two. then top it off. then seal it up and run it to the fan comes on. shut it off and let cool. top off one more time. then fill the overflow bag.

lube the chain;

check the tire pressures;



now before i put all the plastic back on i wanted to check the fault codes. i bought the GS911 and just recently installed it. i didnt get to play with it as much as i would like but from what i have done with it so far i am very impressed. plus, stephan, from GS911, mentioned that you will soon be able to do much more with this unit. the installation was straight forward and idiot proof. i am afraid of technology and it seems the installation instructions online were wrote for me. i am excited. so lets check it out.

after installing and verifying the link you will have an icon on your desk top like this;

now we are ready to play. remove your 911 tool and plug it into your computer, (works with cell phones as well) and follow the prompts;

you will select diagnostic wizard and it will ask you this;

it covers quite a variety of beemers right? we will select "f" series and it will ask;

it says alot that it wants to know whether its a single or twin spark. so we pick twin spark and it asks us if we want to check abs or just engine management. we select engine and it tells us;

then we go back and select absn and it tells us;

so, there were no codes. if there were we could erase them. this system was quick and easy and bikes with more then one control unit it allows you to check them individually. have used the diagnostic tool at bmw stores i can tell you that this is not as good. but if they increase some of the things it can do, like maybe running parameters and the such it could become quite the tool. as it is. anyone traveling very far should have one. it takes you from being the ignorant sod next to his non running bike to the guy calling MAX's or BEEMERBONEYARD and asking for hall sensor or whatever. now your fate is a little more in your hands! gotta customer. will finish what little i have later.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

i would like to add some more about the GS911. there are some codes that may be present for no discernable reason that as a tech we dont get to concerned about. low battery voltage is one. especially if we found a loose battery terminal or like say if it was a city bike where lots of stops and starts or multiple abs usage may start to drag the battery down. now if we had a low battery voltage that occured lets say over 100 times, that would concern us, or you. where gt1 is a far superior diagnostic tool is the things it can do. like watching temp sensors in action or observing the fi signal or watching the o2 sensor in action. hopefully, GS911 will gain some of those features. but, again, it is the only thing out there as far as being able to at least try to get yourself back on the road in the middle of no where. everyone with a beemer should have one of these, it would be the best $150 they ever spent. and not being forced to go to the dealer everytime your scooter flashed a code on your dash has got make it worthwhile!

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

allright, this should be it. so you will not have to listen to anymore of my endless rantings.

we have the bike all put together. everything is filled and the codes have been read. the only thing left is the last test ride.

this was the milage going out for the ride;

and done. the fan came off and on. the weave present before is now gone. the bike starts up and idles, no oil leaks. the only thing missing on this service is the wash. we finished up late so we were unable to wash it. but i gave him an IOU! good at any local bmw dealer i am sure...

why is this man smiling? is it because of the comprehensive and documented service he just recieved? no, i met poopsie, she is smoking!

well, i hope this has not been too painful. let me know what you think.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

Mike in Oregon

That was awesome. I am saving this thread to my computer for future reference!

__________________
Motorcycle nutball

Wannabex2

Great post. Thanks for doing it start to finish.

__________________
You have achieved victory when there is no one left to kill but yourslef.

dakarboy

what did you all think of the GS911?

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

Wannabex2

I do most of my own maintenance but I'm not all that savvy on diagnostics. What are some of the benefits of the GS-11 for the F650GS.

What are some of the things it could help detect so that you can address an issue before it happens?

Could it detect a bad killswitch?
Could it detect that the fan is on it's way to being fried?

It would be cool if it could engage the ABS when replacing the brake fluid.

__________________
You have achieved victory when there is no one left to kill but yourslef.

bobzilla

Wrong sparkplug ends on pic #2?

__________________
Do all your favorite things
cover it with all your dreams
Breathe it, and smoke it, and fuck it
and make it something
05 FE 550 Husaberg plated
06 Dakar

Poppy

Extremely well documented and explained . Nice pics as well. You da man. Well done . Just out of curiosity approx cost on such a service would be ?

dakarboy

i am still trying to calculate it. but i am thinking 800 to 1k out the door. that is of course, counting the valve adjust with the shims. but i will let you know. what would your local shop charge for the same service?

btw, the GS911 will not specify that a kill switch is bad. but it may say something like power interruption to bmsk control unit. then you would have to start checking backwards from there. at least it will start you in the right direction. and again, if you are at hotel and your combi switch goes out, with out GS911 your paying a tow bill to god knows where at the mercy of who knows. in case you cannot tell, i am a huge fan of this unit. it puts us more in control of our own fate and not so dependant on the dealers.

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me

dakarboy

your right. i owe you a beer!

__________________
2003 F650Dakar
1980 SP1000







"IN THE ABSENCE OF REAL TORQUE VALUES, HE-MAN TORQUE SPECS WILL PREVAIL"me