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Old 08-24-2004, 06:45 AM   #1
neduro
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Neduro's Tire Changing Class

I debated on where to put this, and decided on Thumpers as we probably change our tires the most in here. Maybe it belongs in "The perfect line" but I've never been in there, and it seems to compliment Creepers excellent tube thread pretty well. So here goes.

It is a sad fact of life that motorcycle tires are a short lived affair, especially the knobbly ones that so many of us enjoy punishing in the dirt. During the summer, I change tires every other week, or at most, every third week (either putting new ones on or rotating old ones to utilize the sharp side of the knob). Because I do it so much, I have gotten better at it than I used to be, and I thought perhaps I could share that hard won knowledge.

These pictures happen to have been taken changing dirt tires, but the techniques shown here apply equally to street tires (well, maybe not the bits about rim locks and tube positioning). Later this week, I’ll throw new tires on the GS and will document that as well.

Tire changes are not difficult. In putting together this set of directions, I changed both tires on my KTM at an unhurried pace, including shooting 72 pictures which took lots of time to pose, and including cleaning and greasing axles, checking brake pads, and validating spoke tension, in 54 minutes from first picture to last. I never used more than moderate force, did not break a sweat, and no curses were uttered.

A few things to have in mind as you approach this project.
1) If you are using force, you are doing it wrong. You are not stronger than the tire bead, and you don’t want to be (broken beads mean wasted tire). If things are not happening easily, THINK about what forces you are putting on the tire and reposition things to align those forces with what you are trying to do. Like most things, tire changes are more a mental exercise than a physical one.
2) The devil, as they say, is in the details. A small change in position or etc can make all the difference. Pay attention to the subtleties of what you are doing. The single most important thing to notice is that the profile of the rim has a dish, or a low point, at the center where the spokes join. This dish is your friend- if the bead of the tire is resting down in the dish, it will be loose on the opposite side. If not, not even a 50 HP dirtbike can break it free.
3) Always look at the side of the tire opposite where you are working. All of the tension that you are working around is generated over there, not at the point where the tire iron is contacting the tire.

Again, these same approaches will apply to street tires as well, but I’ll just focus on the pictures I have for now and worry about the others later.

Tire Removal:

We’ll assume, for a moment, that you are able to get your bike situated so that the wheel in question is free, and are able to remove it, and so we’ll start with the wheel off the bike and go from there.

I like to change tires using the new (or old) tire as a rest for the work I’m doing. The primary reason for doing so is to keep the sprockets and brake rotors off the floor and unbent. Lots of companies make nifty stands, but I’ve never been able to justify one given how well another tire works.



Step 1: Let air out. Remove the valve stem all the way, so that the tube can ‘breathe’ as you change the volume of the tire through your manipulations. Tip: loosen the valve stem nut, if you have one, prior to letting the air out.



Step 2: Loosen (but do not remove) Rim Lock. Once the nut is loose, push the stem in to make sure that the rim lock has released its grip on the tire carcass. You may need to hit the stem with your socket hammer that you used to loosen the nut to get it to let go.



Step 3: Break the bead. On dirt tires, this is no big deal- I’m doing it here with my chaco’d foot. I can also do it by hand, if I feel like getting dirty. This is the biggest difference for street tires… we’ll get to that later. If you’re feeling uppity, turn the tire over and break the other side right now too, but chances are good that it doesn’t really matter, that it will come free during your other manipulations anyway.



Step 4: Insert 2 tire irons, 4-6” apart, 90 degrees off the valve stem and/or rim lock. You don’t want to go opposite the stem or rim lock because then the bead can’t seat all the way into the dish of the rim. You don’t want to be anywhere close to them because they will make it harder to get the bead out. So, split the difference.



Step 5: Start working around tire away from initial “bite”, inserting tire irons close at first and farther as the bead gets looser. Tip: if the tire is making it difficult to get the iron inside the bead, insert the tire iron just out from where the bead is crossing from outside to inside. It will be a very small bite, but it will be easy to get the iron in.




Step 6: Continue to work all the way around the tire until one whole side is off. Step on the middle of the rim and pull the tube out, taking care to ease the valve stem out through the hole in the rim.




Step 7: Flip rim and tire up to vertical, and insert tire iron as shown to pull second side toward the same as the first. Use the other iron to pull the bead off. Once you get about 1/4th of the way around, you should be able to simply jerk the rim out of the tire.







Congratulations. You are now halfway through the project.
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Old 08-24-2004, 07:04 AM   #2
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Excellent job so far. They just might have to put this in the "how to" section. There are some folks out there that have never done a manual tire change who will really appriciate you're efforts.
Ah, you think you could use a woman's foot for the rest... about a size 6 in a nice stilletto
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Old 08-24-2004, 07:07 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro

Kewl

Do you have to wear "Alabama Safety Boots" to properly change a tire?
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Old 08-24-2004, 07:19 AM   #4
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Old 08-24-2004, 07:49 AM   #5
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Hey, at least I didn't go for flip-flops. Those are the true "alabama safety boots".

Looks like I'm out of bandwidth on Smugmug. I guess the rest of the report will have to wait for next month...
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Old 08-24-2004, 08:29 AM   #6
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Or, you can just give Baldy more money. $16.85 for YFF's. Hope you're grateful.

Next section- Installing a tire, coming soon.
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Old 08-24-2004, 09:11 AM   #7
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A few words before we get started on installing the new rubber.

Your primary task in installing a new tire is protecting the tube from damage. You want to make sure the tube is lying straight throughout the tire, so that it won’t chafe on itself and cause a flat. You want to make sure not to damage the tube with the end of your tire iron. You want to make sure that the valve stem is nicely aligned with the hole in the rim, so that it doesn’t rip the stem from the tube upon shifting.

New KTM’s often locate the valve stem hole relatively close to the rim lock hole, which is very convenient for tire changes as we are about to see, although it does not help the balance any. However, many other makes will have the valve stem and rim lock opposite- I’ll cover that eventuality in a moment.

Some dual-sporters like to run 2 rim-locks, to improve tire balance. I’ve done this, and it does help with balance, but it’s a bitch to install, and no way around it. We’ll save that for the advanced class. Personally, I never bother anymore. I really can’t feel the difference when push comes to shove.

As above, if doing the rear wheel, it is nice to work on the side opposite the sprocket. Plan accordingly.

I do not use any soap or water- I prefer the tire to be a little sticky, so that it holds position as I work on it. Others disagree with me. Experiment and make up your own mind.

Step 1: install the valve stem and add some air to the tube. The goal is to give the tube enough body to roll itself out of the way of the tire iron or etc, without making it hard to get the bead into the dish of the rim. Another important function of adding air before you start is that it will ensure the tube lies flat, with no twists or kinks, inside the tire.

You will be hard pressed to flat the tube with your tire iron if you have added some air first.

Step 2: Install the tube in the tire (I cheated here and put the tube in the tire before adding air).



Step 3: Align tire/tube combo with rim/rimlock combo, so that valve stem is ready to pass through the hole.



Step 4: If the valve stem and rimlock are in the same quadrant of the wheel, you’ve got it easy, because you can pass the valvestem through the hole in the rim, and align the rimlock all at the same time.

If they are opposite, just worry about aligning the rimlock for now. I’ll show pics of how to deal with the valvestem in a moment.

Aligning the rimlock- you want to push the rimlock down, so that it is between both beads of the tire and when the time comes, can suck the beads up and into the rim as it is designed to do. Trust me- if the rimlock is not inside the beads, you will not pass go, and you will not collect $200 no matter how hard you try.

Here the valve stem has passed through…


And here the rimlock has been pushed between the beads and the tire is ready to be pulled on.


Step 5: Pull the first side of the tire down onto the rim, taking care as always to keep the bead in the dish of the rim.





If you could not slide the valve stem in at the outset, here’s where you do so:



Note that the valve stem is aligned with the hole it will pass through.

This picture sucks, but all I’m doing is shoving the valvestem inside the tire.


And this picture sucks too, but I’m lifting up the tire from the opposite side (the one that is already on) so that I can move the valve stem into the hole.



So, now we’ve got one side of the tire on, the valve stem and rim lock positioned correctly, and the second side completely off. We’re in the home stretch.

Step 6: The second side of the tire. You want to start with the portion of the tire immediately adjacent to the valve stem, so that the bead of the tire won’t trap the tube adjacent to the valve stem.



From there, you want to work the shortest route toward the rimlock. If the rimlock and valve stem are exactly opposite each other, whichever direction will be fine.



And finally, you want to finish the tire off 90 degrees from the valvestem and rimlock, so that they are not in the way of getting the bead into the dish of the rim. As always, take care that the opposite bead is down in the dish…



Step 7: Air the tire up. Always fill tubes slowly- not from a 120 psi compressor that’s all charged up. Filling the tube too quickly can result in a twist that does not resolve itself. Bicycle floor pumps are best, but if you must use a compressor (I do), just switch it off once it hits 40 psi or so.

Step 8: tighten the rimlock- this should always be done after adding air to the tire, so that the tube has no chance of being caught between the rimlock and the tire bead, AND so that the tire has the best chance to seat evenly.

Done!


Mmmm… Fresh Meat….

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Old 08-24-2004, 09:22 AM   #8
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Good how-to.

Trick I use is WD40 as a lube for mounting. When it dries it makes the rubber tacky, which damn near glues it to the rim. This makes for a wheel that don't need a rim lock.
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Old 08-24-2004, 09:23 AM   #9
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Excellent!

No soap, no freakin' baby powder... just the way you do it if you have to do it in the middle of nothing and no place.
Good job neduro
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Old 08-24-2004, 09:32 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drif10
This makes for a wheel that don't need a rim lock.

Until you hit water... Used to use WD-40 on my grips, for the same reason, but it loosens up quick once it gets wet.

On the XR, in the desert, it's actually necessary to use 2 rim locks if you're gonna be on it hard. That thing will turn the rim inside the tire otherwise.

As for baby powder, I use it every so often. It does help the tube lie nicely. But with big HD tubes, it is a bit superfluous...
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Old 08-24-2004, 10:32 AM   #11
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Thanks for the demo!
Excellent!
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Old 08-24-2004, 10:44 AM   #12
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Good info Ned. Posts like this are what make you a hell of a guy.
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Old 08-24-2004, 10:46 AM   #13
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Quote:
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Good info Ned. Posts like this are what make you a hell of a guy.

Ned is a hell of a guy? I didn't see any ladies size 6 stillettos in his post... which makes him a wanker... but a hell of a wanker
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Old 08-24-2004, 10:50 AM   #14
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Great how-to Ned

Couple of personal preferences, I like to over inflate and release air to get to desired PSI, just to help things seat.

On offroad tyres, I always tighten the locking nut against the dust cap instead of the rim, this allows the tyre to rotate slightly without ripping the valve stem out of the tube.

Thanks for taking the time and trouble.
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Old 08-24-2004, 11:07 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro


Mmmm… Fresh Meat….


You rang...

Thanks for the thread ned!
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Old 08-24-2004, 11:52 AM   #16
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Old 08-24-2004, 12:02 PM   #17
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Pffft...

No swearing, No pinch flats, no busted knuckles?

That not changing a tire.

Thanks for taking the time and the pictures.
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Old 08-24-2004, 12:21 PM   #18
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Thanks Ned.
I'm gonna go out in the garage tomorrow and give it a try.

You think those Motion Pro tire irons are the way to go? Do you use those same ones out on the trail or the smaller (8"?) ones?
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Old 08-24-2004, 12:22 PM   #19
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Nerudo You don't Only ride like a MadMan

but you are a person of incredible talent..

I thank you for taking your time in making this exelent compendium of tricks and advice..

Note:I think the sandals are a exelent touch since they show how little force you need if you are changing the tyres the "right" way

NOTE II: i will love to see you riding the GS they way you ride the XR that for sure will be something to see
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Old 08-24-2004, 01:13 PM   #20
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Meant to say something about that.

I really like the bend of the Motion Pros- the length isn't really important, but the subtle shape of the ends is nice.

I use short little 'uns out on the trail. Except, I've never had to. (looking for wood to knock).

KM: Let me know if there is anything that is unclear when you go through the process, and I can try to document it better. My intent was to make something worth saving as a reference- it's not there yet, but with some input from folks, I think it could be. So, don't be shy.



PS: both of Ant's tips are good 'uns. Except that he shouldn't be posting here when his Alaska trip report is more important

PSS: If I asked my GF to wear stilleto heels and a short skirt for a tire changing photo shoot that I was doing for a bunch of weird old guys on the internet, I think the report would never have happened. You see, it's hard to change tires with two broken legs and eyes swollen shut...


Quote:
Originally Posted by kirkmoon
Thanks Ned.
I'm gonna go out in the garage tomorrow and give it a try.

You think those Motion Pro tire irons are the way to go? Do you use those same ones out on the trail or the smaller (8"?) ones?
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Old 08-24-2004, 02:03 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro

PSS: If I asked my GF to wear stilleto heels and a short skirt for a tire changing photo shoot that I was doing for a bunch of weird old guys on the internet, I think the report would never have happened. You see, it's hard to change tires with two broken legs and eyes swollen shut...

Didn't have to be your girl friend... just a girl friend
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Old 08-24-2004, 04:01 PM   #22
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I'm sorta notorious for changing my tires at the track before supermoto races. My preferred workstand is a milk crate on the tailgate of a truck. The milk crate won't damage the rim, brakes, or spokes and the tailgate puts everything at a comfortable level. I also use Ruglyde tire lube in a spray bottle for seating the beads on tires a few sizes bigger than the rim I'm using, but it also helps the tube go in and tire slip on a little easier. I have always used the crappy emergency 10" flat tire irons to change my tires... now that I don't know any better, trailside changes don't intimidate me but I figure it took me an extra hour to change both tires on my F650GS the first couple times I did it with the junky irons.

Great how-to, Neduro! Behold the power of the Intarweb!
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Old 08-24-2004, 07:00 PM   #23
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Eh? HD Inner Tubes!

The real challenge is muscling one of those in without puncturing it I still need the machine for those.
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Old 08-25-2004, 07:09 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boottrac
The real challenge is muscling one of those in without puncturing it I still need the machine for those.

HD tubes are easier, because they stay out of the way better with just a little bit of air.

Air it up so it's kinda limp and, dare I say it, flaccid? but has some degree of shape. Stuff it in the tire, and it will stay nicely out of the way, and the air will keep you from hitting it w/ a tire iron. Seriously. They are nicer to work with than light tubes.

The real challenge is Mousses, which is like installing the tire around a fully inflated HD tube. And even those aren't that bad- Buck in Flagstaff from this site can change those things in a few minutes flat. At least, we all hope so, given his trip to Poland in a few weeks...
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Old 08-27-2004, 12:52 AM   #25
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Ruglyde is the way to go!!!

I also use an old credit card or pieces of plastic milk carton between irons & rim to prevent further mucking up my rims.

Thanks for the photo's. Cheers
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Old 08-27-2004, 10:13 AM   #26
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Quote:
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Ruglyde is the way to go!!!

For what? I've never heard of the product... but am interested...
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Old 08-27-2004, 10:29 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro
For what? I've never heard of the product... but am interested...

Stick to KY Ned, that other stuff burns like a mofo...damhik
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Old 08-27-2004, 12:32 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ant Ware
damhik

Don't worry, I won't.




Street tires are now covered in a new thread in Blood, Sweat, and Gears for those who are curious...
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Old 08-27-2004, 12:49 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro
>>Snip
PSS: If I asked my GF to wear stilleto heels and a short skirt for a tire changing photo shoot that I was doing for a bunch of weird old guys on the internet, I think the report would never have happened. You see, it's hard to change tires with two broken legs and eyes swollen shut...
No tall shoes but you got to love a Woman that is not stop by anything


Pumping,PumPinG


Irina First tyre change


I this woman
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Old 08-27-2004, 12:54 PM   #30
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Old 08-27-2004, 01:55 PM   #31
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Old 11-12-2004, 03:21 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro

So ned, we doing this thing? If you translate creeper's istructions (he's AWOL again...) I will do some keyboard work. Now where was that discussion of improving your tire changin thread?
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Old 11-12-2004, 04:20 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meat popsicle
So ned, we doing this thing? If you translate creeper's istructions (he's AWOL again...) I will do some keyboard work. Now where was that discussion of improving your tire changin thread?

Yes, let's do it. I've been meaning to post about this... you know how it goes.

Should we start a thread for collaboration, figure out what all needs to be in there, and then make a clean thread for the hall of wisdom? Or...

Kirkmoon- I remember that you had trouble with some aspect of this. Can you elaborate and maybe we can improve the instructions somehow?

Ned
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Old 11-12-2004, 04:38 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro
Yes, let's do it. I've been meaning to post about this... you know how it goes.

Should we start a thread for collaboration, figure out what all needs to be in there, and then make a clean thread for the hall of wisdom? Or...

Kirkmoon- I remember that you had trouble with some aspect of this. Can you elaborate and maybe we can improve the instructions somehow?

Ned

I know - I will try and live up to my offer...

I think that this thread is as good as any, any doc or pdf for the almighty hall can come from the work here. You can edit your previous posts as Kirkmoon et al funnel the wisdom to ya. I will offer myself as a sacrifice - a virginal guinea pig - to the last draft.

See I have never changed my own MC tires (bicycle yes, but they are easy). My stock Saharas are about 1-2K away from doom and I have another pair of Saharas coming from a friend who sold his DS (got em for the price he paid for knobbies - $105 bucks! ). And they will need to be put on right? What better test of a tire changing spec than me?

I will dig around for that thread with creeper's stuff and we can ask him for some direction on his input. There is some great stuff on Jerome's website that we can ask for too I suppose. He posted it around here somewhere.
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Old 11-12-2004, 04:58 PM   #35
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Old 12-12-2004, 10:54 PM   #36
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Tried to find where he posted this and why... , here it is again:



sumpin' about size matters. width or girth

posted w/out permission - but he will sue my arse off and take my bike thus solving my tire changing needs!
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Old 12-13-2004, 10:45 AM   #37
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That's a nice write up Ned.

I used to use the tire on the tire technique until I bought an $80 dollar hitch mounted tire changer that makes the job even easier. No more bending over no more using my knees. It was money well spent. IMO

Oh and baby powder is my lube of choice. And 756's No wonder you change tire so often.
IRC VE33/35's last way longer and work better for what I do out here. IMO (again)

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Old 12-13-2004, 11:39 AM   #38
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Nice Tire Job......

Can you do it in brown leather for the final copy??

Hope to see you over the holidays; probably will need advice on the 620??

JIm Bud
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Old 12-13-2004, 11:40 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinez
IRC VE33/35's last way longer and work better for what I do out here. IMO (again)

Those things chunk for me- The knobs get ripped off whole. Sometimes they last an hour or two...

We should start a dirt tire thread. I've been experimenting a lot lately. Been pretty happy with the Kenda Millville, although their hard traction isn't the greatest and they also chunk. But they are cheap.

I've got a set of S12's for the race this weekend... never run them before, looking forward to giving them a try.

MP: As for updating this thread, I think the key is focusing on getting the second side of the tire off the rim. When my tools were stolen, I attemped this without the motion pro tire irons shown in this write up, and it was a total b*tch (tire was a Kenda Millville, which fit really tight anyway). Would love to hear other's opinions- if this process leaves any questions in your mind, please post them here or PM Meat Popsicle or myself. Our goal is to make a hall of wisdom worthy tire changing guide...
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Old 12-13-2004, 11:43 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinez
IRC VE33/35's last way longer and work better for what I do out here. IMO (again)

Those things chunk for me- The knobs get ripped off whole. Sometimes they last an hour or two...

We should start a dirt tire thread. I've been experimenting a lot lately. Been pretty happy with the Kenda Millville, although their hard traction isn't the greatest and they also chunk. But they are cheap.

I've got a set of S12's for the race this weekend... never run them before, looking forward to giving them a try.

MP: As for updating this thread, I think the key is focusing on getting the second side of the tire off the rim. When my tools were stolen, I attemped this without the motion pro tire irons shown in this write up, and it was a total b*tch (tire was a Kenda Millville, which fit really tight anyway). Would love to hear other's opinions- if this process leaves any questions in your mind, please post them here or PM Meat Popsicle or myself. Our goal is to make a hall of wisdom worthy tire changing guide...

Last edited by neduro : 12-13-2004 at 11:49 AM.
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Old 12-13-2004, 08:02 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro
I've got a set of S12's for the race this weekend... never run them before, looking forward to giving them a try....

I ran the M12's for a while and loved them when they were new. The problem was that they wore too fast in the center so with them being a wide tire they felt square after 2 rides.
A lot of people like em, I'm not a fan.



I'm looking at that D/S tire thread too because I got the "Z" plated and I'm going to be needing a set to run in some of the events I hope to do.
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Old 03-23-2005, 09:48 PM   #42
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Hey Neduro, I haven't used your valuable info yet, but will in the future.

I just wanted to say a big thank you for taking the time to put all this together. It is those with experience sharing their collected wisdom with us newbies that helps make this place awesome!

You Rock.
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Old 03-23-2005, 10:16 PM   #43
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Yes, great thread. I just fixed the tube on the Maclaren



Wondered what Mrs. Pop was doin with the thing to get two holes in the tube but then saw this:


can't read that? allow me: Cheng Shin Tire...

Luckily for me it didn't take any specialized knowlegde that Ned layed out here; that will come soon when I do my own tires on the KTM
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Old 03-23-2005, 10:44 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meat popsicle
Yes, great thread. I just fixed the tube on the Maclaren


Is that the F1 model?

Quote:
Originally Posted by meat popsicle
Wondered what Mrs. Pop was doin with the thing to get two holes in the tube but then saw this:


can't read that? allow me: Cheng Shin Tire...

Luckily for me it didn't take any specialized knowlegde that Ned layed out here; that will come soon when I do my own tires on the KTM

I think we should start a "What offroad tire do you use for your pimped out baby stroller" thread.
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Old 03-24-2005, 05:41 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GODSPEED
Is that the F1 model?



I think we should start a "What offroad tire do you use for your pimped out baby stroller" thread.


I just couldnt believe that a Maclaren would use Cheng Shin profit margins uber alles
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Old 03-24-2005, 07:27 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meat popsicle
I just couldnt believe that a Maclaren would use Cheng Shin profit margins uber alles


What about BOB ?
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Old 03-24-2005, 07:52 AM   #47
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Nice thread Neduro, thanks for the good tips. I've been changing my own tires for a while with only the tools that I carry with me on the bike, but I haven't gotten to the non-cussing stage yet. I have been using Ru-Glyde to lube the tire to help get it off the rim and I slather it on the tube to allow it to slide around in the tire to help it seat correctly. It's available at auto parts stores by the gallon and I fill a couple of little plastic travel bottles to carry in my flat fix kit. Being a little lazy, I also carry a $6 12v air compressor from Wal-mart. Probably wouldn't hurt to print this thread and carry it with me also cuz I'm a little thick and don't remember much.
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Old 03-24-2005, 08:03 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GODSPEED
What about BOB ?

Don't you mean BOOB?



(back on topic... )
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Old 03-24-2005, 10:58 AM   #49
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I LOVE BOOBs

...Both kinds
P.S. hey Meat, where did ya get that BOOB? How much?
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Old 03-24-2005, 11:04 AM   #50
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I'm glad if this thread is helpful for folks... but I'd still like to make it better. If any of ya'll have any difficulty with spring tire changes, report back here and maybe we can collectively improve the instructions, and then get Baldy to paste the collectively edited version in the hall of wisdom or somewhere (as it's a topic that seems to perenially come up).

Speaking of, there's 6 wheels waiting for rubber in the garage
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Old 03-24-2005, 04:55 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro
I'm glad if this thread is helpful for folks... but I'd still like to make it better. If any of ya'll have any difficulty with spring tire changes, report back here and maybe we can collectively improve the instructions, and then get Baldy to paste the collectively edited version in the hall of wisdom or somewhere (as it's a topic that seems to perenially come up).

Speaking of, there's 6 wheels waiting for rubber in the garage




shit, I got a couple to do misself. and they're TKC's. stiff bastards.
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Old 03-24-2005, 05:15 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro
I'm glad if this thread is helpful for folks... but I'd still like to make it better. If any of ya'll have any difficulty with spring tire changes, report back here and maybe we can collectively improve the instructions, and then get Baldy to paste the collectively edited version in the hall of wisdom or somewhere (as it's a topic that seems to perenially come up).

Speaking of, there's 6 wheels waiting for rubber in the garage

Yeah,excelent thread alright - the only thing I would do different is I always start at the valve and end at the valve,that way when the bead is pulled down into the well it won't possibly damage the valve stem.Tube trials bikes have 2 rim locks on the rear - once when I bought a new tyre they said free fitting...hey,go for it! - ''you don't need two rim locks,I'll leave one out''.....'no you won't mate,you're not taking the easy way out here!'
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Old 03-24-2005, 08:23 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swampy
...Both kinds
P.S. hey Meat, where did ya get that BOOB? How much?

Thats PASSMORE's - it was my easy segue back on topic from the hijack
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Old 04-05-2005, 08:48 PM   #54
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Well Ned, I'm about to find out if I'm any good at changing..

Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro
I'm glad if this thread is helpful for folks... but I'd still like to make it better. If any of ya'll have any difficulty with spring tire changes, report back here and maybe we can collectively improve the instructions, and then get Baldy to paste the collectively edited version in the hall of wisdom or somewhere (as it's a topic that seems to perenially come up).

Speaking of, there's 6 wheels waiting for rubber in the garage

The new Tourances will arrive on Friday, the balancer is here already, and the tire cord is already showing across about an inch of the rear tire....time to change the tires......

thanks Ned.....
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Old 04-08-2005, 09:28 AM   #55
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Well, somethings are harder to do in person...

This tire changing thread sounds real easy, but my big tourrance did not want to budge......

The first thing I discovered, was that the dealer had mounted my rear Tourrance backwards ( must be why I only got 11,000 miles before the steel cord came out), the second thing was that breaking the bead on the rear tire was going to be very hard, so I looked around and reached for some help and here is what worked...still took all my strength to break it loose ( the trick is to move to two or three places on one side to loosen it up and then go to the middle and pop...it's free......




I hope it helps someone else....

thanks Ned..... for getting me started....
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Old 05-15-2005, 12:57 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drif10
shit, I got a couple to do misself. and they're TKC's. stiff bastards.
After bending (and un-bending, and re-bending) a tire iron trying to get a TKC onto a KLR rim, I've given up.


The fact that I'm at home wrenching because I couldn't get the track bike together in time for a (paid for) track day today doesn't help.
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Old 05-15-2005, 01:47 PM   #57
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Like most things in life, it's more technique than strength. You should be able to get 1/2 to 3/4 of the tyre on without irons or lube. The most important part of getting that last 1/4 on is making sure as much as the bead as possible, thats already in, is pushed down into the centre of the wheel, where the wheels circumference is smallest. That should buy you about another inch or so thats needed to get the last little bit over.

Don't give up mate, it's a handy skill to have.
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Old 05-15-2005, 03:42 PM   #58
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Got it. This diagram (from the Cycoactive site) was also helpful:

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Old 05-15-2005, 04:01 PM   #59
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Got it. This diagram (from the Cycoactive site) was also helpful:

A picture paints a thousand words
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Old 05-15-2005, 04:06 PM   #60
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Eh?



did someone say "spare tire"?
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Old 05-15-2005, 04:40 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meat popsicle
Yes, great thread. I just fixed the tube on the Maclaren

That's not a McLaren....this is a McLaren

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Old 05-27-2005, 10:43 AM   #62
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Thank you, thank you, thank you.

I just changed my stock MT21 for a Maxxis 6006. I haven't changed a motorcycle tire in 30 years. Not that I want to change tires all the time, just that I wanted to be sure I could at my age!

The biggest bitch was removing the second bead of the old tire. It just took some time. When I tried to remove one tire iron to move it to a new spot, the tire wanted to roll back on the rim.

I ended up using just plain water as a lube. It seemed to make the process go a lot easier.

One question I have. The SXC did not come with a nut to hold the valve stem in place on the rim so it was a pain to get the air chuck on the valve without it wanting to praire dog and go back in the rim. I found an old nut off my IT175 and put it on to help in inflating the tube.

Should I leave the nut on or is there a reson there is no nut on the valve stem?
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Old 05-27-2005, 10:54 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by techieguy
The biggest bitch was removing the second bead of the old tire. It just took some time. When I tried to remove one tire iron to move it to a new spot, the tire wanted to roll back on the rim.

Leave the one lever that goes all the way through in place with lots of pressure on it, and use a second lever to keep pulling off little bites until you've got about 1/3rd of the rim bare. Then, you should be able to pull the rim one way and the tire the other and be finished.

Quote:
Originally Posted by techieguy
One question I have. Should I leave the nut on or is there a reson there is no nut on the valve stem?

Generally, it doesn't matter. But if you spin the rim within the tire (a frequent occurance in some cases), you can rip the valve stem out with the nut in place, where it might just go into the rim without it.

If you run more than 15 or 20 psi in your tires, it's probably a non issue.
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Old 05-30-2005, 10:50 PM   #64
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Thanks, neduro, for these instructions. Here's a well deserved bump for this this thread. I only had 2 problems - getting the old tire off, and the new one on. It took only 2.5 hrs. for a new rear D606 tire.

I had a problem getting one side of the tire over the rimlock, and then getting the beads around the edges of the rimlock. I liked the pics showing the tube valve stem alignment (and the hint to put some air into the tube). Should I have removed the rimlock from the wheel, and put it on top of the tube inside the tire, then as I put the tire on, put the rimlock through the hole? Or should I have left the rimlock on the rim, and muscled the beads around the rimlock? (which is what I did. )

So far, the tire is holding air and looks like it seated OK.
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Old 05-31-2005, 05:33 AM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by murgatroid42
Should I have removed the rimlock from the wheel, and put it on top of the tube inside the tire, then as I put the tire on, put the rimlock through the hole? Or should I have left the rimlock on the rim, and muscled the beads around the rimlock?

If you start the first bit of the new tire around the rimlock, (rimlock installed, but pushed in so that there's plenty of clearance between rim and lock, then slide the tire into that gap first, before working it down anywhere else around the rim)... then you shouldn't ever fight around the rimlock.

Only time it's appropriate to leave the rimlocks out is if you're using two- then, leave the rimlocks and tube out, put the first side of the tire on, put in the rimlocks and the tube, and then put on the second side. Except it only sounds that easy.

Hope that helps.
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Old 05-31-2005, 08:35 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro
If you start the first bit of the new tire around the rimlock, (rimlock installed, but pushed in so that there's plenty of clearance between rim and lock, then slide the tire into that gap first, before working it down anywhere else around the rim)... then you shouldn't ever fight around the rimlock.

Only time it's appropriate to leave the rimlocks out is if you're using two- then, leave the rimlocks and tube out, put the first side of the tire on, put in the rimlocks and the tube, and then put on the second side. Except it only sounds that easy.

Hope that helps.
My rimlock is opposite (180 out) from the valve stem. My mistake was putting the first side of the tire on the rim starting at the valve stem, so the stem would not move. I should have put the first side of the tire starting on/under the rimlock, THEN put the SECOND side of the tire on the rim starting at the valve stem.

It's still holding air.
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Old 06-12-2005, 09:35 PM   #67
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Step 5: Pull the first side of the tire down onto the rim, taking care as always to keep the bead in the dish of the rim.

I totally misunderstood this line, and it gave me no end of trouble this weekend putting a GP110 rear on my KLR.

I kept trying to keep the bead seated all the way around as I levered on. Which, clearly, makes it impossible to lever the second side all the way on. I struggled for the last 1/4 of the second side for two afternoons, breaking the tip off of one tire lever in the process.

Once I FINALLY realized I needed to keep the bead UNseated until it was all over the rim, it was dead simple to finish.

Bah. I'll treat it as a learning experience. I hope the front is as easy as post-revelation rear when I get to it...
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Old 06-12-2005, 09:43 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flaterik
I totally misunderstood this line...

Anything that could be done to make it clearer?
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Old 06-12-2005, 11:33 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro
Anything that could be done to make it clearer?

For someone being as dense as I was, the best thing would've been an explicit "this means keep the bead unseated, and down in the middle of the wheel" at that point. I didn't realize until I re-read it after finishing that I realized "dish" didn't mean "the place where the bead goes".

(why did I think it would go on while it was seated? that doesn't make any sense.)
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Old 07-05-2005, 10:45 PM   #70
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Thanks Ned
I just finished my first tire change on my LC4. Your directions were perfect for me. I changed the front in under 1/2 an hour, but the rear took me 3 days

I couldn't break the bead on the rear for the life of me. So I took the 4th off and drank beers then today took the wheel to the local shop and they broke the bead for me then I continued tonight and everything went close to perfect. Definately the key for me was standing on the tire to squeeze it into the centre of the rim to take the tension off the tire where the tire irons went in.

I do have a problem however. I suspect my rear tire is not quite the right size. I have deflated and inflated twice and I can't get the bead to seat nicely all the way around the tire. It's perfect except for opposite the valve stem where the bead is too far inside the rim by maybe 5mm-8mm - a noticable amount. I mounted the wheel and when I spin it, it doesnt look true to me. I'll take it for a short SLOW test ride in the morning. Any ideas? It's an IRC Road Winner 150/70 - 18, I bought it off a guy on ktmtalk.

Cheers,
Nick.
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Old 07-05-2005, 11:52 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncfitton
Thanks Ned
have deflated and inflated twice and I can't get the bead to seat nicely all the way around the tire. It's perfect except for opposite the valve stem where the bead is too far inside the rim by maybe 5mm-8mm - a noticable amount.

Yeppers, bead not seated. Probably started out with too much bead on one side and not enough on the other. Hate it when that happens. Suggestions:

1. Deflate the tire again, and BREAK THE BEAD ALL AROUND ON BOTH SIDES. I can use a big tire spoon to do that on mine, but bigger stiffer tires may require an actual bead breaker tool. If so, buy one.

2. Once the bead is broken all around, try to re-center the tire on the rim.

3. Inflate the tire *slowly*, while bumping it with a rubber mallet all around to help center itself. Most tires have a little ridge on the bead. Try to whack the tire in such a way as to move the tire towards where that ridge is close to the rim, and away from where that ridge is far from the rim.

4. Feel free to overpressure the tire slightly (figure that any tire has at least a 25% safety factor, so if, e.g., it says 35psi max, feel free to pressure it up to 45psi) and sometimes bouncing on the *opposite* side of the low side will help.

5. Deflate and repeat rubber mallet treatment if this didn't work the first time through.

6. No guarantees if your tire explodes in your face because you believe me. (Note: I've never had a tire explode in *my* face, but that may just be the gods looking out for me).
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Old 07-06-2005, 05:07 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncfitton
I do have a problem however...

Nick, I know it's a little too late now but try rubbing a light coating of 50/50 water/washing up liquid (or whatever you're using for tyre lube) around the bead of the tyre before you inflate it.

If the tyre you're working with now doesn't seat after a short ride, deflate, push the bead away from the tyre at the unseated spot using your irons and drop some tyre lube down in there, then inflate 'til it seats. (I've seen unlubed KTM 950 rear's take over 70psi to get seated, lubing should help you keep the pressures down)

Ned's a bit of a purist, so he'll be along in a minute to tell you not to use any lube and only use the tools you carry in your fannypack...oh yeah...and wait 'til the heat of the day and get outside in the sun and do it
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Old 07-08-2005, 06:33 PM   #73
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I've changed 950 rears 2x now, and had to use Windex each time to get the bead over that ridge...

But Ant's right about one thing- make the change in the hot Nevada Sun...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ant Ware
Ned's a bit of a purist, so he'll be along in a minute to tell you not to use any lube and only use the tools you carry in your fannypack...oh yeah...and wait 'til the heat of the day and get outside in the sun and do it
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Old 07-12-2005, 06:37 AM   #74
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[guiness commercial] Insert the tube in the tire before mounting the tire on the wheel? BRILLIANT! [/guiness commercial]

I wrangled with my new Karoo rear for an hour before I gave up, cursing. What I'd call 'a whole lot of fucking and not a lot of friction' (me going fuck! fuck! fuck! FUUUUUUUCK!). Realizing there's a better way and I'd better stop before I break something, I said 'hey, Neduro posted something about a tire changing class a whle back.' Lo and behold, putting half the tire on and then trying to fish the tube thru wasn't the best way. 10 min later I had that bastard on. And it's still holding air this morning so I didn't pinch the tube. Thanks Ned!
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Old 07-12-2005, 06:48 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ant Ware
try rubbing a light coating of 50/50 water/washing up liquid (or whatever you're using for tyre lube) around the bead of the tyre before you inflate it.

If the tyre you're working with now doesn't seat after a short ride, deflate, push the bead away from the tyre at the unseated spot using your irons and drop some tyre lube down in there, then inflate 'til it seats.


thanks for the tips ant and ned.

unfortunately i tried soap and i tried to deflate/inflate 3 times - all very tedious with my bicycle foot pump

in the end i took the wheel back to the local shop that broke the old bead and they inflated it to 120 psi for me and the new tire bead popped right into place. i was never gonna get it with my foot pump.

n.
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Old 07-12-2005, 07:07 AM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncfitton
thanks for the tips ant and ned.

unfortunately i tried soap and i tried to deflate/inflate 3 times - all very tedious with my bicycle foot pump

in the end i took the wheel back to the local shop that broke the old bead and they inflated it to 120 psi for me and the new tire bead popped right into place. i was never gonna get it with my foot pump.

n.

hey nick,

say, won't a gas station air hose do that as well?

hi to the fam!
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Old 07-12-2005, 07:11 AM   #77
Ant Ware
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncfitton
...all very tedious with my bicycle foot pump...






BTDT...I go tired of carrying my wheels round to the gas station once a month so I invested in a compressor.

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Old 07-12-2005, 08:46 AM   #78
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i bought a compressor yesterday

i could have gone to the gas station - if i was certain that only the pressure was the problem. the rim has a ding in it and the tires came from a dodgy source, so i wanted a pro to take a look before the whole thing blew up in my face.
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Old 07-23-2005, 10:19 AM   #79
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Hey Ned, nice write up.

This morning I r&r'd the rear MT 21 on my 625, first time in at least 25 years. Like techie, I just needed to see if I could do it and your article gave me the incentive so I found my old tire irons and gave it a go. Your write up and pictures are quite clear and the whole process went reasonably well. Here are a couple observations from this mornings fun. Also like Techie it was the back side that was difficult possibly because a tire that is beefy enough to take the weight and power of a 625 is pretty stiff.

1.0 Tire irons. I used one like the ones you have and the other is about as long as my hand. I hold with the short one and pry with the long one. For the back side I think two long ones ( like yours ) would be much easier.

2.0 Lube. I wimped out and lubed it when the going got tough. This made it alot easier.

3.0 When doing the last 1/4 on the back side I found that wiggling the iron ( w/ the lube ) helped pop the lip over the rim.

Will I do another one? Sure. Is it easy? No.
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Old 07-24-2005, 02:24 PM   #80
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I also gave this tire changing a try after seeing this thread and it went pretty well. It took me a couple hours in total but most of that time was spent wrestling to break the bead on the rear. I took the stock Trail Wings off and put a MT21 on the front and a Kenda 270 on the rear. Big Props to Neduro for convincing so many of us to put the checkbook away and get the tools out...we all owe you some beers at the very least. Thanks for the great thread!!
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Old 09-12-2005, 09:16 PM   #81
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Hey Ned, I was thinkin of you today.



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Old 09-13-2005, 09:06 AM   #82
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Was doing a bit of that myself the other morning...



Luckily, there was a flat-topped stump nearby...



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Old 09-13-2005, 04:56 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neduro
Was doing a bit of that myself the other morning...



Luckily, there was a flat-topped stump nearby...




God Bless logging.
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Old 09-13-2005, 06:22 PM   #84
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dirtrider and i weren't thinkin about you fuckers... shit... we weren't thinkin about much... we was drunk! but we did manage to fix the flat 950 tire in mere seconds once the goddamned bead was broken... if you've never broken a 950 bead i highly recommend trying. it's an experience lemme tell you



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Old 09-13-2005, 06:26 PM   #85
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ps... that aint patchable.

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Old 09-13-2005, 06:29 PM   #86
Max Power
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loadedagain
ps... that aint patchable.


Just use a big patch.
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Old 09-13-2005, 06:36 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Power
Just use a big patch.

three didn't work... but we had a half dozen spare tubes

unfortunately they were not with the bike when he got the flat.

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Old 09-13-2005, 06:39 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loadedagain
three didn't work...


Nice.
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Old 09-14-2005, 01:43 AM   #89
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Loaded, you just weren't trying.
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Old 09-18-2005, 06:24 PM   #90
patch29
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Drif10 speedy tire installation video, here. This version was squished when it went to mpg1.

If someone has some bandwidth to spare I have a larger (240x320) Quicktime version, 6.9mb PM me if you want to host it.
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Old 09-18-2005, 06:50 PM   #91
patch29
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Cromag 05 tire changing station, hosted by Drif10.

First a wounded GS.



Wheel Removal.



The Breaking of the Bead.



A little lube, for Dizave's tire beer was used, is that a party foul?













See the video above for the speedy installation method.



















Success once we found large air compresser.

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Old 09-23-2005, 11:24 AM   #92
DoctorIt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patch29
once we found large air compresser.
No, actually, the sound when it finally seated itself was more like POP!!!
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Old 11-24-2005, 05:08 PM   #93
Dread Pirate Wesley
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Finally decided to roll up my sleeves and put your excellent instructions to the test on my KLR.

Previous owner had put on Maxxis 6006 - they worked well, as long as I remembered to deflate for offroad and re-flate for on road. If I ran on the street below 15 psi the felt waffely in the corners and if I ran them above 20 offroad the felt squirrely on gravel. They were also a little noisy at speed and I wanted something a little more street oriented for highway riding.

I bought MEFO 99's but they sat in the garage for 2 months until today :)

First - let me tell you - if you have Maxxis Tires - PAY SOMEONE ELSE TO BREAK THE BEAD at least on the rear one!

I weigh about 270 - I stood on them - I put the kickstand on em - I pounded them with a BFH - I even tried driving over the rubber part with the wifes car - and then the truck - not even a hint of popping that bead off...

It finally took a ramp properly positioned and my 3/4 ton Dodge Ram - I had to place the ramp - then drive up onto it - twice - for each side!! Holy crap those sidewalls were stiff!

FINALLY - We have bead break!




After that it was gravy - after spending over 2 hours just trying to break the bead on the old rear tire - it took less than 35 mins to do all the rest - mounting new rear, remove & replaceing the front - (popped the bead on the front just by standing on it) and viola - all done....

I like the new look:






Tnaks for the excellent step by step - I wuldna done it with out you :P
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Old 12-20-2005, 11:58 AM   #94
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Found by searching for a recommeded tire from these fellas:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...t=98839&page=5
I thought they might have a good opinion.

They recommeded the Mefo Stone Master, this list of tire for the Honda Transalp came up:
http://www.transalp.de/technik/reife...sicht.php#mefo

I always thought it would be great to have a dedicated tire thread, but I already have one hobby () and hoped someone else might bite.

Jerome has a nice table on his site (reposted around) for the LC4, and with combined knowledge and resources such as the one above might lead to a very useful thread.

Anyone steppin' up?
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Old 12-20-2005, 12:09 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by timf


That chain adjuster isn't on there right
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Old 12-21-2005, 09:47 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meat popsicle
Found by searching for a recommeded tire from these fellas:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...t=98839&page=5
I thought they might have a good opinion.

They recommeded the Mefo Stone Master, this list of tire for the Honda Transalp came up:
http://www.transalp.de/technik/reife...sicht.php#mefo

I always thought it would be great to have a dedicated tire thread, but I already have one hobby () and hoped someone else might bite.

Jerome has a nice table on his site (reposted around) for the LC4, and with combined knowledge and resources such as the one above might lead to a very useful thread.

Anyone steppin' up?

Redirect from an inapropriate thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by PASSMORE
Both of ya'll shadddup and bow to the Tera-Flex

We all know that it is the best no matter the metrics...





Now back to exhausts...

How does it compare to the Mefo StoneMaster?
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Old 01-09-2006, 09:52 PM   #97
ErrinV
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Thanks for this thread Neduro. I did the rear tonight on my 640. Took me about 4 hours. Kicked my ass. Didn't even think I'd be able to finish it, but I learned alot doing it and will do the front last night. Probably shouldn't have started it so late in the day in the winter. Was wishing for some of that Cali sunshine to heat it up. I'm beat and and I can honestly say that I've had my ass kicked by the Baja. The Michelin Baja.

Errin
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Old 01-09-2006, 10:03 PM   #98
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Errin, Can't wait to hear more about this. It sounds like a REAL adventure...

CONGRATS on your Baja adventure!!!!
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Old 01-10-2006, 10:10 PM   #99
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So I attempted the front today. I was able to change it within an hour, however when I filled it with air i realized that I punctured the tube so I had to do it over. Then I get it fixed and take both the front and the rear to the gas station because I couldn't get my sparrow to fit. Something's wrong with the cap. So while at the gas station I realize that not only is the bead not seated properly on the front, I had punctured the tube in the rear the night before. Damn. So end up reseating the front, and then redoing the rear. Only now, with all this experience I get them both done in an hour. So then I go back to gas station and pump them up and you guessed it. IT WORKED!!!! Go home and mount them up and rode it down the street. Now I'm just keeping my fingers crossed that the air is still in there in the morning.

So I ended up doing 1 tire change, 2 tube changes and reseating a tire today. Plus I used up my spare tubes so I'll have to get new ones tomorrow. Yesterday I only did one rear in 4 hours, so I feel much better about doing it now. Changing the tire yesterday kicked my ass becausing I was using too much force, but tonight I got the hang of it and it wasn't that difficult. The proper technique helps out tremendously. That reminds me, I need an air compressor.

Many thanks for this thread Ned.

Errin
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Old 02-28-2006, 01:17 PM   #100
dieter von hexhead
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Quite simply the "Citizen Kane" of tire changing threads.....






.....thanks Ned!
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